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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 9:54:14 GMT -8
It was in Colorado, cuz he was wearing the white Kings jersey, but he was with the Kings. I watched the game. And the King's did think so, they just couldn't afford his contract after bringing in Richards & Carter... So they traded him back home to Edmonton, where he should never have left anyways. 🤷 Youre absolutely crazy if you think THEY wanted Smyth still at 6M but just couldn’t afford him. Hell, EDM didn’t want him, just couldn’t bear the fan outrage over him going to CGY instead Im sorry you have trouble trading. But look at ALL the cup winners. All took old vets after downgrades and won. This isn’t the issue you think it is And my point was, you’re looking from the perspective of YOUR players. Which you are. And YOUR experience only. Most people didn’t have an issue with this. You reference stuff, but again look at ALL the league leaders from every season. It’s not just young guys. You’re just wrong. It happened to him again when he was with LA, it just wasn't quite as brutal as the Johnson one was. lol And yeah, once the got Richards & Carter, paying him $6M to be a 2nd liner wasn't feasible for them, and effectively couldn't afford it. Simple as that.
Back to topic... As for it not being a problem, clearly it is, cuz I'm not the only one that believes it is, or else Lu wouldn't have brought it up dude. 🤷 So it's not just MY experience, when others are talking about it as well. Besides, who else's experience am I going to draw from other than my own? 🤔🤨 lol What a ridiculous statement of you to make. 🙄 And you're right, nearly all championship teams are comprised of mostly veteran players, which really should increase their value, but it doesn't. As soon as they hit 27-28, that's it... They're perceived value hits the basement unless they're an 88-89+, and, even then, their value allegedly drops as soon as they hit a certain age, even if they are producing and not regressing season to season, superstars or not. There's is literally no point at all that these player's are face value. It's all perceived value and projection, never face value, ever. |
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Post by Slovan Stags GM on Aug 26, 2022 10:34:26 GMT -8
Youre absolutely crazy if you think THEY wanted Smyth still at 6M but just couldn’t afford him. Hell, EDM didn’t want him, just couldn’t bear the fan outrage over him going to CGY instead Im sorry you have trouble trading. But look at ALL the cup winners. All took old vets after downgrades and won. This isn’t the issue you think it is And my point was, you’re looking from the perspective of YOUR players. Which you are. And YOUR experience only. Most people didn’t have an issue with this. You reference stuff, but again look at ALL the league leaders from every season. It’s not just young guys. You’re just wrong. It happened to him again when he was with LA, it just wasn't quite as brutal as the Johnson one was. lol And yeah, once the got Richards & Carter, paying him $6M to be a 2nd liner wasn't feasible for them, and effectively couldn't afford it. Simple as that.
Back to topic... As for it not being a problem, clearly it is, cuz I'm not the only one that believes it is, or else Lu wouldn't have brought it up dude. 🤷 So it's not just MY experience, when others are talking about it as well. Besides, who else's experience am I going to draw from other than my own? 🤔🤨 lol What a ridiculous statement of you to make. 🙄 And you're right, nearly all championship teams are comprised of mostly veteran players, which really should increase their value, but it doesn't. As soon as they hit 27-28, that's it... They're perceived value hits the basement unless they're an 88-89+, and, even then, their value allegedly drops as soon as they hit a certain age, even if they are producing and not regressing season to season, superstars or not. There's is literally no point at all that these player's are face value. It's all perceived value and projection, never face value, ever. 3rd/4th line, because that’s what he was. Because he lost a step, or 3 Perceived value I’m not gonna do anything about. That’s on you guys not the system. Luo actually had other points. And what I mean when I say you’re talking bout YOUR issues is, you’re making it sound as if it’s some HUGE problem and EVERYONE feels that way. They don’t. So that’s my point. He also was being constructive, but you make these discussions impossible to have because you have the inability to do that. You just start calling names and make it sound like everything is broken because Smitty still would’ve been relevant lol So maybe just scrap downgrades all together then? Because thats what it seems like you actually want. What’s your solution even? No age downgrades? Not until 40? 45? Hell, how long did Gordo play? 55? Why stop there? What it comes down to it on downgrades, everyone happy when it happens to someone else and it raises value of your players, but no one happy when it happens to them. You’d be bitching the reverse saying everyone has xyz and now so and so has to go on waivers because his “perceived value” as 86 is nothing now because all the OG players still up there. Players in the NHL as a whole don’t just get better every year, and I wish you’d just be realistic on what needs to happen in these leagues. I see you in every league bitching about the exact same things. Like this discussions goes back AT LEAST to first lockdown back on HLS. And then you have the balls on Heinz league to tell others to stop bitching. I want a discussion, but this is such a dead horse Can you at least move on to a different issue that actual adds something or addresses something else? |
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Post by Traktor Chelyabinsk GM on Aug 26, 2022 10:48:37 GMT -8
Ie Ovi being an 86 at 42 years old lol Ovie will be the new Gordie |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 10:53:34 GMT -8
Ie Ovi being an 86 at 42 years old lol Ovie will be the new Gordie Why not? 🤷 Jagr was still at least an 86-87 at 46 yrs old. |
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 26, 2022 11:00:37 GMT -8
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 26, 2022 11:02:04 GMT -8
Ovie will be the new Gordie Why not? 🤷 Jagr was still at least an 86-87 at 46 yrs old. Where? In the Czech republic? Guy wasn't even in the league at this point. |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 11:24:50 GMT -8
It happened to him again when he was with LA, it just wasn't quite as brutal as the Johnson one was. lol And yeah, once the got Richards & Carter, paying him $6M to be a 2nd liner wasn't feasible for them, and effectively couldn't afford it. Simple as that.
Back to topic... As for it not being a problem, clearly it is, cuz I'm not the only one that believes it is, or else Lu wouldn't have brought it up dude. 🤷 So it's not just MY experience, when others are talking about it as well. Besides, who else's experience am I going to draw from other than my own? 🤔🤨 lol What a ridiculous statement of you to make. 🙄 And you're right, nearly all championship teams are comprised of mostly veteran players, which really should increase their value, but it doesn't. As soon as they hit 27-28, that's it... They're perceived value hits the basement unless they're an 88-89+, and, even then, their value allegedly drops as soon as they hit a certain age, even if they are producing and not regressing season to season, superstars or not. There's is literally no point at all that these player's are face value. It's all perceived value and projection, never face value, ever. 3rd/4th line, because that’s what he was. Because he lost a step, or 3 Perceived value I’m not gonna do anything about. That’s on you guys not the system. Luo actually had other points. And what I mean when I say you’re talking bout YOUR issues is, you’re making it sound as if it’s some HUGE problem and EVERYONE feels that way. They don’t. So that’s my point. He also was being constructive, but you make these discussions impossible to have because you have the inability to do that. You just start calling names and make it sound like everything is broken because Smitty still would’ve been relevant lol So maybe just scrap downgrades all together then? Because thats what it seems like you actually want. What’s your solution even? No age downgrades? Not until 40? 45? Hell, how long did Gordo play? 55? Why stop there? What it comes down to it on downgrades, everyone happy when it happens to someone else and it raises value of your players, but no one happy when it happens to them. You’d be bitching the reverse saying everyone has xyz and now so and so has to go on waivers because his “perceived value” as 86 is nothing now because all the OG players still up there. Players in the NHL as a whole don’t just get better every year, and I wish you’d just be realistic on what needs to happen in these leagues. I see you in every league bitching about the exact same things. Like this discussions goes back AT LEAST to first lockdown back on HLS. And then you have the balls on Heinz league to tell others to stop bitching. I want a discussion, but this is such a dead horse Can you at least move on to a different issue that actual adds something or addresses something else? The ONLY time Smyth was ever a 3rd/4th line player was in his initial couple seasons, then top 3 for basically the rest of his career. You can state your opinion all you like cuz you didn't like him as a player, or his style of play, or whatever, but it doesn't change the fact he played on the top line everywhere he went, just not prodomanently in Colorado when they were playing Forsberg on the left side with Sakic instead. You can't say any different, cuz it's a fact. Do you know how many folks I've talked to over the years, just like you, that believed him to be a bottom 6 player cuz he wasn't a flash'n'dash phenom that was dekeing guys out of their jock straps every night? Probably about 90-95%, and nearly all of them were surprised AF at his production numbers.
First off, this is discussion right? 🤨 Why do I have to just concede to everything you say if I don't agree with it? 🤔🤷 That doesn't make sense. You just get ornnary cuz I don't always concede. I haven't called anyone names at all in this discussion, yet you harken back to that from other discussions of the past as some sort of a crutch to attempt to diminish my point of view. And even when you are given examples, you outright refute it, regardless of whether it makes sense to you or not, cuz you are a proponent of the young pups being the centre attraction, when not all of them should be right away. Transversely, you're not being realistic either, cuz players don't just forget how to play, go senile, and regress to virtually Pee-wees in one season either, just because they get to a certain age. That's not realistic either. |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 11:28:54 GMT -8
Why not? 🤷 Jagr was still at least an 86-87 at 46 yrs old. Where? In the Czech republic? Guy wasn't even in the league at this point. Oh gee sorry... 44. 🙄 |
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Post by Slovan Stags GM on Aug 26, 2022 11:33:44 GMT -8
3rd/4th line, because that’s what he was. Because he lost a step, or 3 Perceived value I’m not gonna do anything about. That’s on you guys not the system. Luo actually had other points. And what I mean when I say you’re talking bout YOUR issues is, you’re making it sound as if it’s some HUGE problem and EVERYONE feels that way. They don’t. So that’s my point. He also was being constructive, but you make these discussions impossible to have because you have the inability to do that. You just start calling names and make it sound like everything is broken because Smitty still would’ve been relevant lol So maybe just scrap downgrades all together then? Because thats what it seems like you actually want. What’s your solution even? No age downgrades? Not until 40? 45? Hell, how long did Gordo play? 55? Why stop there? What it comes down to it on downgrades, everyone happy when it happens to someone else and it raises value of your players, but no one happy when it happens to them. You’d be bitching the reverse saying everyone has xyz and now so and so has to go on waivers because his “perceived value” as 86 is nothing now because all the OG players still up there. Players in the NHL as a whole don’t just get better every year, and I wish you’d just be realistic on what needs to happen in these leagues. I see you in every league bitching about the exact same things. Like this discussions goes back AT LEAST to first lockdown back on HLS. And then you have the balls on Heinz league to tell others to stop bitching. I want a discussion, but this is such a dead horse Can you at least move on to a different issue that actual adds something or addresses something else? The ONLY time Smyth was ever a 3rd/4th line player was in his initial couple seasons, then top 3 for basically the rest of his career. You can state your opinion all you like cuz you didn't like him as a player, or his style of play, or whatever, but it doesn't change the fact he played on the top line everywhere he went, just not prodomanently in Colorado when they were playing Forsberg on the left side with Sakic instead. You can't say any different, cuz it's a fact. Do you know how many folks I've talked to over the years, just like you, that believed him to be a bottom 6 player cuz he wasn't a flash'n'dash phenom that was dekeing guys out of their jock straps every night? Probably about 90-95%, and nearly all of them were surprised AF at his production numbers.
First off, this is discussion right? 🤨 Why do I have to just concede to everything you say if I don't agree with it? 🤔🤷 That doesn't make sense. You just get ornnary cuz I don't always concede. I haven't called anyone names at all in this discussion, yet you harken back to that from other discussions of the past as some sort of a crutch to attempt to diminish my point of view. And even when you are given examples, you outright refute it, regardless of whether it makes sense to you or not, cuz you are a proponent of the young pups being the centre attraction, when not all of them should be right away. Transversely, you're not being realistic either, cuz players don't just forget how to play, go senile, and regress to virtually Pee-wees in one season either, just because they get to a certain age. That's not realistic either. Smyth top 3 is absolutely delusional. Is that you Smytty? Im not gonna say it again, but look at all the leaders. It wasn’t “young pups” so you’re wrong. But you just keep you head in the sand man. I addressed the examples you and Luongo were saying. Those are exceptions, not anything to change a rule about. It’s not the norm. Do you get that? I jump back to those other discussions with you because that’s basically what this is for you. And extension of your constant hard on for making things difficult. It’s always just a harken back for you Whats your solution I’ll ask again? Because it really seems like you’re advocating for no age downgrades and that’s not gonna happen. How many players are even aged 34+ in the league right now? |
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 26, 2022 12:21:49 GMT -8
3rd/4th line, because that’s what he was. Because he lost a step, or 3 Perceived value I’m not gonna do anything about. That’s on you guys not the system. Luo actually had other points. And what I mean when I say you’re talking bout YOUR issues is, you’re making it sound as if it’s some HUGE problem and EVERYONE feels that way. They don’t. So that’s my point. He also was being constructive, but you make these discussions impossible to have because you have the inability to do that. You just start calling names and make it sound like everything is broken because Smitty still would’ve been relevant lol So maybe just scrap downgrades all together then? Because thats what it seems like you actually want. What’s your solution even? No age downgrades? Not until 40? 45? Hell, how long did Gordo play? 55? Why stop there? What it comes down to it on downgrades, everyone happy when it happens to someone else and it raises value of your players, but no one happy when it happens to them. You’d be bitching the reverse saying everyone has xyz and now so and so has to go on waivers because his “perceived value” as 86 is nothing now because all the OG players still up there. Players in the NHL as a whole don’t just get better every year, and I wish you’d just be realistic on what needs to happen in these leagues. I see you in every league bitching about the exact same things. Like this discussions goes back AT LEAST to first lockdown back on HLS. And then you have the balls on Heinz league to tell others to stop bitching. I want a discussion, but this is such a dead horse Can you at least move on to a different issue that actual adds something or addresses something else? The ONLY time Smyth was ever a 3rd/4th line player was in his initial couple seasons, then top 3 for basically the rest of his career. You can state your opinion all you like cuz you didn't like him as a player, or his style of play, or whatever, but it doesn't change the fact he played on the top line everywhere he went, just not prodomanently in Colorado when they were playing Forsberg on the left side with Sakic instead. You can't say any different, cuz it's a fact. Do you know how many folks I've talked to over the years, just like you, that believed him to be a bottom 6 player cuz he wasn't a flash'n'dash phenom that was dekeing guys out of their jock straps every night? Probably about 90-95%, and nearly all of them were surprised AF at his production numbers.
First off, this is discussion right? 🤨 Why do I have to just concede to everything you say if I don't agree with it? 🤔🤷 That doesn't make sense. You just get ornnary cuz I don't always concede. I haven't called anyone names at all in this discussion, yet you harken back to that from other discussions of the past as some sort of a crutch to attempt to diminish my point of view. And even when you are given examples, you outright refute it, regardless of whether it makes sense to you or not, cuz you are a proponent of the young pups being the centre attraction, when not all of them should be right away. Transversely, you're not being realistic either, cuz players don't just forget how to play, go senile, and regress to virtually Pee-wees in one season either, just because they get to a certain age. That's not realistic either. |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 12:41:15 GMT -8
There's no reason to even dignify that with answer Crank. 🤷 Anyone can do a simple Google search and find the birth year furthest out that there's virtually no one left playing, or the worst class of birth year. But, if you do want an answer, it's the ones that are still playing, save for possibly Allen who's had it rough cuz both teams he's been on have had goalie depth out the ass, and Brodie, who was a top 10 defenseman at one time, but he plays for Toronto now. Carlson still plays at a high level, Connauton is playing exactly how he was projected to play, having never being an offensive guy and is still going, Bogosian was unfortunately overrated off the hop as a top pairing D, which was never the case, and Chaisson is playing exactly how he was projected to play, maybe a touch higher than expected, but like Connauton, he's consistent. That's why he still has a job. 🤷 |
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 26, 2022 13:08:13 GMT -8
There's no reason to even dignify that with answer Crank. 🤷 Anyone can do a simple Google search and find the birth year furthest out that there's virtually no one left playing, or the worst class of birth year. But, if you do want an answer, it's the ones that are still playing, save for possibly Allen who's had it rough cuz both teams he's been on have had goalie depth out the ass, and Brodie, who was a top 10 defenseman at one time, but he plays for Toronto now. Carlson still plays at a high level, Connauton is playing exactly how he was projected to play, having never being an offensive guy and is still going, Bogosian was unfortunately overrated off the hop as a top pairing D, which was never the case, and Chaisson is playing exactly how he was projected to play, maybe a touch higher than expected, but like Connauton, he's consistent. That's why he still has a job. 🤷 1990 is 32 year old, which is the age we're discussing in terms of starting downgrades. I'm highlighting that the majority of players, aged 32, have begun their decline. But sorry, you feel the ones that are still playing are all at the top of their games? |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 26, 2022 13:20:55 GMT -8
There's no reason to even dignify that with answer Crank. 🤷 Anyone can do a simple Google search and find the birth year furthest out that there's virtually no one left playing, or the worst class of birth year. But, if you do want an answer, it's the ones that are still playing, save for possibly Allen who's had it rough cuz both teams he's been on have had goalie depth out the ass, and Brodie, who was a top 10 defenseman at one time, but he plays for Toronto now. Carlson still plays at a high level, Connauton is playing exactly how he was projected to play, having never being an offensive guy and is still going, Bogosian was unfortunately overrated off the hop as a top pairing D, which was never the case, and Chaisson is playing exactly how he was projected to play, maybe a touch higher than expected, but like Connauton, he's consistent. That's why he still has a job. 🤷 1990 is 32 year old, which is the age we're discussing in terms of starting downgrades. I'm highlighting that the majority of players, aged 32, have begun their decline. But sorry, you feel the ones that are still playing are all at the top of their games? Trying to highlight it is moot in this case cuz a majority of them listed there as 1990 babies never even had a prime, and/or we're career AHLers, for the most part, or bottom 6 guys. And yeah, the ones that I highlighted as such, absolutely are playing at the top of THEIR games, not some all encompassing bar that's the same for everyone, because no two players are exactly alike. I'm not going to hold Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, cuz Connauton was never an offensive defenseman in the slightest, whereas Carlson is a guy that goes out and gets a boatload of points. |
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 26, 2022 17:53:11 GMT -8
1990 is 32 year old, which is the age we're discussing in terms of starting downgrades. I'm highlighting that the majority of players, aged 32, have begun their decline. But sorry, you feel the ones that are still playing are all at the top of their games? Trying to highlight it is moot in this case cuz a majority of them listed there as 1990 babies never even had a prime, and/or we're career AHLers, for the most part, or bottom 6 guys. And yeah, the ones that I highlighted as such, absolutely are playing at the top of THEIR games, not some all encompassing bar that's the same for everyone, because no two players are exactly alike. I'm not going to hold Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, cuz Connauton was never an offensive defenseman in the slightest, whereas Carlson is a guy that goes out and gets a boatload of points. If you sort the list by Pts, you'll have some more NHL examples to look through. But honestly, I'm not sure wtf ur going on about regarding holding Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, so I'm going to choose to no longer engage for my own sanity. |
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Post by Seattle Spitfires GM on Aug 27, 2022 16:20:35 GMT -8
Trying to highlight it is moot in this case cuz a majority of them listed there as 1990 babies never even had a prime, and/or we're career AHLers, for the most part, or bottom 6 guys. And yeah, the ones that I highlighted as such, absolutely are playing at the top of THEIR games, not some all encompassing bar that's the same for everyone, because no two players are exactly alike. I'm not going to hold Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, cuz Connauton was never an offensive defenseman in the slightest, whereas Carlson is a guy that goes out and gets a boatload of points. If you sort the list by Pts, you'll have some more NHL examples to look through. But honestly, I'm not sure wtf ur going on about regarding holding Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, so I'm going to choose to no longer engage for my own sanity. They're both on your goofy little list you of 1990 babies, right? 🤷 You want me to use your reference, I do, then you tuck tail cuz "Oh fuck... Kruze is making a point I don't understand." 🙄 That's why you ask questions |
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Post by Atlanta Thrashers GM on Aug 27, 2022 17:09:33 GMT -8
If you sort the list by Pts, you'll have some more NHL examples to look through. But honestly, I'm not sure wtf ur going on about regarding holding Connauton to the same bar as Carlson, so I'm going to choose to no longer engage for my own sanity. They're both on your goofy little list you of 1990 babies, right? 🤷 You want me to use your reference, I do, then you tuck tail cuz "Oh fuck... Kruze is making a point I don't understand." 🙄 That's why you ask questions They're both on my goofy little list you of 1990 babies... I never thought of it that way before, but you're right! |
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